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Random quote: "Let him who seeks, not cease seeking until he finds, and when he finds, he will be troubled, and when he has been troubled, he will marvel and he will reign over all.” ~~ (Jesus, Gospel of Thomas)
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Transcript 20 feb
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   General Discussion -> The Gathering Place (TGP)Message format
 

Posted 2003-02-26 9:22 PM (#3510 - in reply to #3505)
Subject: RE: Transcript 20 feb... Part 3 end


Robbieh:- Umm, when I was trying to understand this……..it took a long time to understand it, but you have been talking about this since right after September 11th, and how I have been able to understand it, is that I get flooded with all of these other pictures of the same situation, but on a smaller scale and closer and when there is an integrity to it, it will run through every single one of those examples and it will fit in every single one of those examples..because its its universal…. I…. I am not able to say it really well… but it should fit every….. single….. circumstance ……. And it does, and that’s how you can tell you have got it ….. you’ve honed in on it …… is that right?fficeffice" />>>

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Raj:- Exactly.. that is correct. >>

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Robbieh:- ok.>>

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Raj:- Mark>>

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Mark:- You’ve told me more than once I am not a sperm and an egg, is ……DNA ….part of the mutually agreed upon definitions?>>

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Raj:- NO>>

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Mark:- Its the way things work?>>

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Raj:- Noooo ……. Nothing that you see is the way things work, the way things …..work and things working… because God is being creation … look like that……. Its going to look like something, and no matter how great the magnification of the microscope, with which you look at the visibility and tangibility of God, you’re going to find order, and its going to look like something. But what it looks like isn’t what makes it work like it works. ……. God working, God being the movement of creation looks like something, and its because what God is being that it looks like it looks. And part of the problem that everyone is having in your scientific community…. Is that your looking at it as though your trying to arrive at …God…… but they would say the ultimate meaning of…. Ahh ah… what they are studying …… their their their………trying to arrive at the ultimate meaning by studying what they have defined to be matter …… and so they are all studying their mutually agreed upon definition …. which is that this is some result of a big bang ….. of a physical event that had nothing to do with God. If they would look at it, as though they were seeing the visibility and tangibility of God …… mind….. they would begin to discover radically new things.>>

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Mark:- There are mutually agreed upon definitions…. about DNA?>>

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Raj:- Indeed ……. And one of these is that it is matter….. instead of spirit……. That it identifies as some self existent substance ……… rather than the look of what God is being.>>

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Mark:- DNA is love>>

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Raj:- All substance is love …….. all substance is spirit.>>

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Mark:- One thing I did notice ahhh, ……you said that the suffering wasn’t generic suffering……that it was specific to your experience…. What’s on your plate, that’s the word you used and we are all here listening, and I just want to help everyone here remember that the foundation is suffering.>>

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Raj:- laughs.. >>

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Mark:- because that seems to be on my plate.>>

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Raj:- You know what…… suffering is need unmet………. very simply…. So look where there is need, and find a way to meet it…….. not through your best judgements, not through your best definitions, not through any separated vantage point, ………but by recognising the need and saying “God what’s the truth here, God what do…I … need to see…” ….not about this illusion.. …. But what do I need to see about the reality that this illusion is about …….and what do I need to know and feel in order to address the need, so that the need disappears …. And is replaced by… need met ….. which means no need.>>

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New speaker:- Good evening Raj.>>

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Raj:- Good evening >>

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(I am nicknaming New Speaker as Divine J.) Dougy>>

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Divine:- As I am sitting here listening to what your saying about, groups, within groups, within groups, and we are all immersed in definitions … and how we are to be in this sea of definitions,.. which I see, which I am beginning to, it occurred to me that just reverberating reactions,…. Constantly reverberating reactions to everything, that… if we are joined with the Father we are embodying meaning, so that we are coming into any situation with the embodiment of meaning, which is the answer.>>

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Raj:- Yes>>

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Divine:- And so, whatever we are looking at, or whatever is coming across our field of vision, we see the answer.>>

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Raj:- And….>>

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Divine:- In other words we don’t make decisions any more.>>

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Raj:- That is correct.>>

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Divine:- because we see the answer, we see what the answer or the need in the moment for that particular moment ……because we are joined (from background…. You Are the answer) yeah right, right, but what I am trying to say here is we are in a state of observation….. not in a state of reaction .>>

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Raj:- Not….. Observation can be from a distance, ahh it is better to say that you are in a state of awareness, of of alert consciousness… from  which it is easy for you to act with other appropriateness in ways that allow for shifting to occur without…. without increasing fear on the part of the one doing the shifting.>>

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So ……you see, one can observe without being involved and so I do not want to ummm. …..I do not want that word ..observation…to be employed very often.>>

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Divine:- What I am trying to say is, if you have a blank mind, meaning you don’t have a lot of definitions or judgements….. you are trying to be in wherever you are, without any definitions ….. your looking… trying to look,…. with clear eyes…. You know. (more muttering in background)>>

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Raj:- That’s right.>>

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Divine:-.. Yah…. Your trying to sit, ….. what is really going on here, I mean….>>

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Raj:- Your saying… Father show me what is going on. (joined by speaker… what is going on)>>

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Divine:-  ah … you’ve made your… and I don’t know if this is correct word ..Private.. but you go within …your connection….. and then your moving from then on, in a continuous ask….state of asking  because your feeling your way through the situation… not trying to think…>>

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Raj:- That is correct>>

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Divine:- or join with the definition,  so everything ..aahhhh… your not connected by definition any more.>>

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Raj:- That is correct, you are not connected by definitions that is correct.>>

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Divine:- So that…that being…that state of being.. everyone feels that state of disconnect of you, from that, which I think is what you were saying when you stand out?>>

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Raj:- Other… others will feel your disconnect… but at the same time..will feel your connection with the answer, they will feel you connection with capital M meaning, and you …will be ….involved and extending the gift that peaks their curiosity….and…… doesn’t threaten them.>>

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Divine:- this takes a lot of practise.>>

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Raj:- It does and practise comes from involvement>>

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Divine:- Involvement, in other words, . I know I blow it a lot, but I am repeating it, I am not running away from it now, so that I will get the feel of it more and more and I will get more sensitive… to what is needed.>>

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Raj:- Yes>>

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Divine:- I mean you’ve gotta start somewhere, even if its in judgement, you will get the feedback, so that you can refine and refine and refine.>>

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Raj:- That is correct >>

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Divine:- Okay… I think I get…see what you are saying….. thanks>>

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Raj:- Your welcome.>>

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Ammi:- Okay…. I would like to take this back to the course directly and see if ….. haaaaah…. I can make it apply to the generic suffering………. or specifically some of what you mentioned which appears to be out my purview… such as starving in Africa, or aids in Africa, or starving in Korea or………. the pending war in Iraq versus the tyranny in Iraq ……………and do it in a way that doesn’t put me in Michaels pseudo happy dream, that isn’t shared by every citizen of the planet (soft laughter from background) ………..I love you Michael (chuckles)>>

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Raj:- We love you Michael (softly)>>

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Ammi:- And in the course there, there seems to be a contradiction or a very difficult point that you highlighted there in that, and I thought of immediately two lessons in the workbook, one of which, lesson 38 “There is nothing my holiness cannot do” and conversely.. when you talked about choosing to turn toward the altar, rather than being for or against, my thought was to the lesson that said … ummm, that plane cr…. God did not create that plane crash, so it cannot be real…. God did not create that famine, so it cannot be real, God did not create that war and so it can’t be real, God did not create that tyranny so it cannot be real, which seems to be the place Michael was coming from………. And that is a lesson in the course, but I am sure somehow it ties in to also  “There is nothing my holiness cannot do” and there is a merger of  the two, between action and belief.>>

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Raj:- Absolutely…………….. and there better……. Be…….. the merger.>>

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Now what I have shared tonight needs not, to be used…… as a way of moving into a safe zone, where….. where your having a much clearer picture of how it works and …. Therefore you can go home this week, and mull over what I have said, and ……enjoy it like a tasty morsel that you roll it round on your mental tongue and umm maybe for the next seven days you don’t have to pay attention to what your seeing in the newspaper, what your seeing on the TV, and having a vote to cast about it….. I didn’t say having an opinion about it…. But caring enough to ask….. within…. Until you are in filled with a clarity.so that you know what your vote is……and then….. especially if its not a vote that you like……daring to commit to it anyway, and doing the hard work, and having to act in harmony with Gods will, whether you like it or not……… that’s what’s hard.>>

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Ahh you have got to get your hands dirty, and you have to deal with things you don’t like, because there are things that are wrong going on that need to be corrected. And you know what, I am going to leave you tonight, with something to consider ……..Judgement is called for in your process of yielding to the Father…in your process of waking up……. There is a great tendency to look at things that are going on and say…like I said before ….its an illusion…or…that’s just their perception.>>

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And never arrive at a point of saying this works and this doesn’t, this reflects the will of God, and this doesn’t….. you have to make a distinction between the tares and the wheat ………. And you have to cast your vote….you have to learn to recognise what is real and what is  unreal, and commit to what is real and withdraw your commitment from what is not……and you cant stay in a safe noncommittal place where your saying…that’s just your opinion or that’s just your perception or that’s just their perception….it’s not real anyway….and refrain from making the distinction, between what is true and what is not….and committing to what is, and withdrawing your commitment from what is not.>>

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Again we are talking about becoming involved, not talking about having an opinion…….. Your going to have to ask the Father is this real or not……..your going to have to make distinctions or you are forever going to be stuck… in…….the mutually agreed upon definitions….. your mutually agreed upon definitions ….are ……not true…. And until you are willing to look at them squarely to find out whether they are or not, so that you can see that they are not……you …won’t… know….how to make the correction, and if you don’t make the correction, it goes on uncorrected and you are still….., in …..the ……dream. >>

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One way or another your going to get off the fence, and I am not going to let you forget that that is what you are here for, and it means involvement, it means caring enough to discern what is true and what is not, so that you can withdraw your investment of  energy and attention from what is not true. Because until you invest your energy in what is true, you …will… NOT …be embodying God, and you will NOT get to a happy dream.

if we ever get to the next section…………you will see that it is called “the meaning of the last judgement’…….so hey people……..its time……… its time to discover how good the meat and potatoes of the course are…… but your going to have to chew in order to digest it, your going to have to put forth the effort………. And  stop wishing for …..
parfait, and pudding, and nice soft sweet stuff…. You see………… ok….. now Michael (laughter in background)…… This …can be fun………. It can be …….. but it won’t be…………. (More laughter)…………. I have selected Michael to be the only one…….. (laughs)……….. no… this this this applies to everyone……. (someone goes Phewwww) ……. You see I use meat and potatoes..because I know there are many that savour and thoroughly delight in a good meat and potatoes meal, even though its more difficult to digest than pudding, and parfait and ice cream, and I am saying that the effort need to be put forth, in order to be involved in order to not be on the fence, in order to embody, to act out into manifestation, the clear manifestation of God, is as satisfying as meat and potatoes is…….. but if your delicate, and you think spirituality is about delicate but beautiful things, you know floating around in pinkness and lavender, uhhh meat and potatoes is not going to sound desirable to you……. I am telling you that the meat and potatoes of waking up ….is…. satisfying…the work the effort you have to put forth, to care enough for your brother and sister to get involved to get off the fence …..and Act……to change the world, and so that any video camera scanning the scene will see harmony and peace and beauty and love expressed. …………is worth it, is satisfying…………so hahhhhh……………….>>

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Douglas:- This is where the recorded stream ended, so I presume that was it.>>

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